Episode 20: RevOps vs. GTM Ops

In this episode of the RevOpsAF podcast, co-host Matt Volm and Andy Mowat, VP of GTM Ops at Carta, discuss the growth of revenue operations and why many in the field are asking themselves a philosophical question: 

Should we call ourselves revenue operations or go-to-market operations? 

Andy has run GTM Ops at Upwork, Box, Culture Amp, and Carta. He’s also started multiple companies himself. While many RevOps leaders come from Sales Ops, Andy grew his career in the Marketing Ops and Customer Success Ops side of the equation. Now, he leads GTM Ops at Carta and believes that operators must manage the entire revenue funnel to be successful.

Evolution of RevOps

“If you’re just reporting to the Head of Sales, or just reporting to the Head of Marketing, you cannot drive deep change through the funnel.” - Andy Mowat

Andy identifies the cause of silos in operations teams as stemming from a leader that’s too steeped in Sales Ops. The result is a tendency to treat other teams, like marketing and customer success (CS) as second tier. 

This tendency of RevOps to lean towards the sales team is why Andy feels that the name GTM Ops is a better fit for the role. Matt disagrees, saying that revenue is the glue that holds together marketing, sales, and CS. Revenue operations is all about handoffs and overlaps that make a cohesive engine.

Jump to the clip to hear how CS, along with other departments, suffer from silos.

Rise of Go-to-Market Ops

“I see it as people just need a sexier name.” - Andy Mowat

Doubling down, Andy believes that very few people are actually thinking across departments because they haven’t practiced in each of them. From territory planning to demand generation, to post-sales, few have the skills. More senior people end up running GTM Ops because they have this experience, compared to those running RevOps.

Matt presses on the idea, asking Andy if he believes that the CRO title should exist based on this belief. Andy says that he’s seen CROs, Chief Growth Officers, COOs, and Chief Sales Officers run revenue and they all have their benefits. 

Jump to the clip for Andy’s hot take on how, for many companies, RevOps is just SalesOps.

Defining Go-to-Market Ops vs. RevOps

“What is RevOps? If you meet someone in RevOps, what do they do? That's the fuzziness I have.” - Andy Mowat

For Matt, go-to-market operations is too narrow. “In the literal sense, you have an addressable market. Marketing and sales drive new logos, new acquisitions, but it has nothing to do with actual customers,” he says. Working with customers is a completely different motion separate from go-to-market. 

Andy highlights that CS Ops and Sales Ops should be moved closer together. A customer success manager and an account manager are both working on deals and using contracting tools in the CRM. They work on the same numbers and the same accounts. GTM Ops keeps them aligned. 

Jump to the clip and grab your popcorn for a spirited debate on the merits of RevOps versus GTM Ops.

Reporting Structures in RevOps

“I couldn't care less what the title of the person I report to is. I care more about: are they somebody I can manage up to effectively?”- Andy Mowat  

RevOps often reports to a CRO, who can sometimes just be a glorified VP of Sales. This can cause problems because there’s no accountability or ownership of anything outside of supporting the sales team and the CRM. There’s a huge amount of value in a true CRO or Head of RevOps who oversees operations end to end.  

While Matt believes that titles matter, Andy says that it’s more important to have a leader that he can manage up to and who will help drive decisions across the GTM funnel. Whether it's the COO, CRO, CFO, or CEO, all that matters is that he can do the work he came to do.  

Jump to the clip to hear which walk-on song Andy would choose as he enters the stage at RevOpsAF.

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